Future Criminals

Maybe I’m overreacting when I say I believe the following cases are signs of American decline.   Both have been in the news, but I felt compelled to comment on them.

The first story comes from Bear, Deleware…

A Delaware first-grader who was facing 45 days in an alternative school as punishment for taking his favorite camping utensil to school can return to class after the school board made a hasty change granting him a reprieve.

Zachary Christie, 6, had faced 45 days in an alternative school for troublemakers after he took the utensil — a combination folding knife, fork and spoon — to school to eat lunch last month. Now, he could return Wednesday.

What a little scumbag!  Probably a future rapist, serial killer, and worst of all, conservative.  This overt display of masculinity must be stomped out.  Why was he eating anything that would require cutting anyway?  Get this little neanderthal on a vegetarian diet asap.  Think of the horrific scene he must have caused in the lunch room.  Most of all, to the overworked, underappreciated, saintly teachers.  I call this a hostile work enviroment.

It wouldn’t be so bad if some weren’t still defending the decision….

Not everyone believed the school district was out of line.

Jennifer Jankowski, who runs the special education programs at Jennie Smith Elementary in Newark, said schools need to be vigilant about protecting students. If Zachary or another student had been hurt by the knife, she said, the district would have taken the blame.

“If we can’t punish him, then what about kids that did bring (a weapon) for bad things?” Jankowski said. “There’s more to the school’s side than just us being mean and not taking this child’s interests into account.”

 Women also HATE HATE HATE beta 1st graders.  God forbid this harpy takes the child’s interest into account.  She might be required to “take the blame”.  The horror.   Hey Jennifer, what if a child used a pencil to stab someone?  Are you able to make a distinction between children who want to use the pencil violently, and children who just want to write with it?  I’m sure Mzz. Jankowski is a font of reason and common sense.  Would anyone want their boy near this shrike?

This is the problem with all things government run.  Cover your ass uber alles.  There is no reward or benefit to using common sense.  Why?  Because the “I was only following orders” sheeple who 1st suspended him won’t be punished.  Zero tolerance policies are put in place to avoid accountability.  I’m not surprised a woman is defending such stupidity either.  Accountability, reason, distinctions, and common sense are not always their strong suit. Exceptions are duly noted. 

Nice message this sends to the little boy.  I hope his parent’s stress to him that he did nothing wrong.  Public schools are a toxic environment, especially for males. 

 

The second story comes from Lansingburgh High School in New York…

  A 17-year-old Eagle Scout in upstate New York has been barred from stepping foot on school grounds for 20 days — for keeping a 2-inch pocketknife locked in a survival kit in his car.Matthew Whalen, a senior at Lansingburgh Senior High School, says he follows the Boy Scout motto and is always prepared, stocking his car with a sleeping bag, water, a ready-to-eat meal — and the knife, which was given to him by his grandfather, a police chief in a nearby town.

 

But Lansingburgh High has a zero-tolerance policy, and when school officials discovered that Whalen kept his knife locked in his car, he says, they suspended him for five days — and then tacked on an additional 15 after a hearing.

 They not only suspended him for the mandatory 5 days, but decided to tack on an extra 15 for good measure.  Keep in mind the people who make these decisions walk among us every day.  You see them at the grocery store, the mall, or a sporting event.  Self important, tyrannical little sheeple. It’s easy to see how dictators come to power so easily with these types roaming around. 

 He said his school’s assistant principal, Frank Macri, approached him on Sept. 21 and asked him if he was carrying a knife.

It’s not only the women who are guilty of this kind of stupidity. Mangina’s are also perfectly suiting for the role of petty bureaucrat.  I’m sure this lickspittle is as threatened by the boy’s testosterone as a rabid feminist would be.

“They brought a cop in, who told them ‘he’s not breaking any laws, so I can’t charge him with anything.'”

Whalen said he asked Macri why a 2-inch pocketknife would be considered more dangerous than other everyday items around the school.

“I said to him, ‘What about a person who has a bat, on a baseball team? That could be a weapon.’ And he said, ‘Well, it’s not the same thing.'”

Everything involves the police nowadays. When the most innocuous acts are looked at with suspicion it’s hard to cultivate a healthy respect for the law.  Whalen probably received the stiffer penalty for questioning the “wisdom” of the “zero tolorance thinking” policy.  In fact, a baseball bat is far more dangerous than a two inch knife.  I would rather have this 17-year-old making policy for school districts than the petty little tyrants that are actually in charge.  Read the rest for more idiocy.

I wouldn’t spit on Frank Macri’s ass if it were on fire.  Despite school policy he could have ignored it, or simply told the kid to get rid of the knife.  That would have required him to put his ass ever so slighty on the line though.  Better to be a coward.  This mentality is rewarded richly in totalitarian regimes. ( Ed: This was poorly worded.  I do not mean to suggest the U.S. in 2009 is a totalitarian regime. Only that people of this mindset are found in every society.  They are worth fighting.  Even for relatively “trivial” matters.  I doubt its trivial to the boy in question though.)

Hopefully these young men can make amends with their government overlords.  Dropping out would be nice.  The masculine presence probably makes the gay, female, and transgendered students feel uncomfortable anyway.  At the very least they better learn how to properly put a condom on a banana and recycle.

  

Note: Due to work obligations and an upcoming vacation my blog time will be curtailed for a few weeks.

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Alpha or Beta?

Classic Links, Labels, Spending, Healthcare and Baseball

Aoefe writes about labels humans apply to themselves and others from August of 2009

Ricky Raw discusses the power of vagueness from February 2008

Thursday’s thoughts on Gwen Stefani and related issues from October 2007

Welmer writes about cheating military wives from April 2009

Roissy talks about the kind of girls who go to bars from August 2008

 

The acronym MRA gets thrown around quite a bit, but what does it really mean?  I am especially guilty of this myself.   I use it as shorthand for blogs that discuss mens issues that aren’t exclusively game oriented. Sometimes I even use it when I really mean MGTOW.  Not very precise I must say.  The problem I see, speaking for myself only, is that I am not exclusively focused on rights and I’m certainly not an activist. I’ve thought about it a little bit and came up with an acronym which better describes me. MIP.  Mens issues proponent. 

Issues encompass everything.  The micro, the macro and everything in between.  The personal, political, historical, and cultural. I’m not just concerned with mens legal rights.  Heck, I’m concerned with everyone’s  legal rights.  In fact I spend more time talking about micro (Game) and cultural issues, both on here and elsewhere, than about laws being changed.

Proponent simply means lending a voice.  I’m not important or wield any ability to change much. I don’t take to the streets.  I don’t hold placards.  Not only for mens issues, but everything else.  I didn’t go to the local tea party rally for example.  Despite my conservative views, my demeanor is pretty moderate.  Shouting into a bullhorn or chanting slogans doesn’t do it for me.  Not necessarily opposed to it, just not my bag. I’m a mens issues proponent in the same way I am a school vouchers proponent, or low taxation proponent, or private health care proponent.  So no, I’m not an activist

 If I didn’t have a blog I probably wouldn’t give it a second thought. In writing especially, its nice to be able to quickly sum up a point of view without writing a 4 page dissertation on it.  I use “conservative with libertarian leanings” in the same way.  I also embrace the label: Bronco fan.  I welcome thoughts on this.

 

Adam Sharpe at Seeking Alpha wrote an interesting piece on deficit spending.  He provides a graph.  HT: Ace of Spades

5 gold stars and the title of “Ganttsquarry’s Commenter of the Month” goes to the person who can guess what I am thinking.

 

An example of the Utopia that is Britain’s healthcare system.  Terrible story.  RIP Mathew Millington.  HT: AoS

 

Not to sound like a pony tail sporting, patchouli oil wearing hippy, but I think it’s a shame how Major League Baseball handles inclement weather in the post season.  As you might know, the Rockies and Phillies got postponed yesterday due to snow and freezing temperatures here in Denver.  It got rescheduled for today, or more precisely, tonight….at 8 o clock.  It won’t be in the 20’s like last night, but I doubt it will be over 35 or 40.  The game won’t end until 11 pm either. 

The Rockies/Phillies play 162 games to get into the playoffs and then have to play crucial games in freezing weather not conducive to high level performance.  Pretty lame. Why?  TV contracts.  The rational thing to do is schedule the game for 1 pm.  This is not exactly an issue that threatens the foundation of the republic, but I’m glad I could get it off my chest.

Now I’m off to go watch the Broncos play a sport perfectly suiting for cold dreary weather.

A Couple Links

 Robert Stacy McCain at his blog in a comments section…

The Right Guy wrote: This has to be the most reckless example of social promotion and affirmative action.

(Ed: RSM) You will notice that (a) I waste no mercy on feminism and yet (b) very seldom mention race-based affirmative action. There are reasons for this.

Feminism, and the favoritism toward women it demands, heaps unearned advantages on the overprivileged — that is to say, it bestows additional benefits to upper-class college-educated American women, who are by birthright the most spectacularly advantaged people in all human history.

It is not the blue-collar waitress or the dropout retail clerk who benefits from the tilted playing field that feminism requires, but rather the well-born daughters of the affluent, who have attended the best schools and who cruise through life without ever having experienced any hardship whatsoever. No matter how WASPy or wealthy or elite-educated they may be, feminism hands these women a platinum-plated Victimhood Card, which they play ruthlessly to wring every possible advantage from life.

Should it ever be your misfortune to have to deal with one of these haughty, indolent creatures in your workplace, God grant you the serenity not to call her out, for then you will be guilty of sexual harassment — as if such a worthless thing could ever be worth the bother to “harass.”

Whatever the unfortunate impact of affirmative action for ethnic minorities, they are rarely so insufferable as a rich 23-year-old white girl who expects the entire world to bend over her kiss her overprivileged ass.

 

Mass murderer Dylan Klebold’s mother writes an essay for Oprah Winfrey’s magazine.

 “Dylan’s participation in the massacre was impossible for me to accept until I began to connect it to his own death. Once I saw his journals, it was clear to me that Dylan entered the school with the intention of dying there. And so in order to understand what he might have been thinking, I started to learn all I could about suicide.”

 

“Early on April 20, I was getting dressed for work when I heard Dylan bound down the stairs and open the front door. Wondering why he was in such a hurry when he could have slept another 20 minutes, I poked my head out of the bedroom. ‘Dyl?’ All he said was ‘Bye.’ The front door slammed, and his car sped down the driveway. His voice had sounded sharp. I figured he was mad because he’d had to get up early to give someone a lift to class. I had no idea that I had just heard his voice for the last time.”

 

“For the rest of my life, I will be haunted by the horror and anguish Dylan caused,” she wrote. “I cannot look at a child in a grocery store or on the street without thinking about how my son’s schoolmates spent the last moments of their lives. Dylan changed everything I believed about myself, about God, about family, and about love.”

Notable Quotables

“Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country.”  Mayor Marion Barry, Washington, DC.

Reactions To Novaseeker and a Response to Obsidian

I wanted to specifically address the issue of whether knowledge and interaction with women bring unique insights and wisdom. I will work off of some posts Novaseeker has made at three blogs on the subject.  

 From Chuck’s blog

I agree that throwing out women wholesale is not the best approach. I do think there are some people in the MRA-sphere who are inexperienced with women and so on. However, many of us are NOT inexperienced with women, have been married to women, fathered children with women and so on. To paint all of us with one brush (and I know you had a tiny disclaimer in there in a wall of text) is dumb. Inaccurate and dumb.

Agree completely. My only question to Nova, (a wise, well read, excellent writer and thinker and really smart guy, someone who I suspect has more wisdom than I do I might add) is does he think he gained wisdom and valuable insight from being married? 

One more question…

If all MRAs had little or no personal experience with women would their collective wisdom be greater or smaller?

I think its obvious.  Men like Welmer, Nova, and Elusive Wapiti bring more wisdom to the table with regard to mens issues not less.  Sure I can speak to marriage and divorce, but not with the insights and authority they can.  After all, I’ve never been married or divorced.

But the more important problem with your post is that it equates knowledge of relating to women with “wisdom”. That’s inane. Yes, knowledge of interacting with women is nice to have if you want to interact with women, as most of us do. But does it make us wise? Gosh, that’s one of the silliest things I’ve ever read. Wisdom follows from many things, but understanding how women work and how to relate to them is not one of them.

First I’ll state that many experiences in life bring wisdom. Especially endeavors that test virtue and resolve or require hard work and discipline.  Let me use a few examples.  Lets take two typical 30-year-old guys.  Identical in every way.  IQ, values, upbringing, physical attributes, job, education…blah blah blah…except for one thing.  One guy served 2 tours in a war zone and the other guy has zero military experience.  Who would probably possess more wisdom?

How about the same two guys, but one of them had successfully battled cancer?

How bout the same two guys but one has 10 friends and the other has 0? 

How about if one of them is married and has 2 children?

The last example is what I am getting at.  I submit that everything being equal, the married with kids guy is probably going to have more wisdom than the single guy.  I say this as a single guy myself.  Living with another human being, and all it entails, bring valuable insights.  Children within marriage, (necessitates interaction and some understanding of women) bring wisdom.

How bout the same two guys, but one of them has had 5 girlfriends and the other has had zero?

I believe, again, everything equal, the guy with 5 girlfriends is going to probably have more wisdom.  Relationships, great or terrible, provide keen insights into human interaction.  I know I’ve learned from them.  I learned a lot about myself.  Both my good and bad qualities were more easily recognized.

What I’m trying to get at is that HUMAN interaction, for most people, brings wisdom.  I tend to think a car salesman would generally be more wise in the ways of the world than a guy who works the graveyard shift at a warehouse. The former, if he has any curiosity or self awareness,would be able to offer all sorts of tidbits and observations on the human condition which the latter probably couldn’t. 

Human interaction doesn’t just bring knowledge, it can bring wisdom as well.  I know some not so well educated types who possess much greater wisdom than the college educated ivory tower intellectuals wandering around.  The former’s insights come from human interaction, not reading. (Reading can of course provide wisdom though.)  I think this is obvious and I don’t see why interaction with women would be any different.

Luckily, all things aren’t equal.  For instance, I have two married friends.  One is incredibly insightful while the other is as dull as a rusty butter knife.  Even though the latter has many experiences I can’t relate to, I consider myself wiser than he is. My other experiences, taken as a whole, trump his.

It is also possible to be wise in some areas and not others.  I know a leftist like this.  In matters of business and personal relationships he is dynamite.  When talking politics he has all the insight of a 10-year-old girl.  Trite wouldn’t even begin to describe it.

One of my best friends has very little experience with women. Giving him advice on the subject is, for the most part, futile.  When it comes to the ladies, he sucks.  That being said, he is one of the most stand up guys I have ever known.  I’d go to the gates of hell for him.  He is also really astute in other areas.  He is deep and philosophical.  I value his opinions.  With women I have more wisdom, but on other things, he does.  I also would say,on balance, he is more valuable to society than I am despite my advantage with women.

One last example.  A friend of mine from years ago was solidly an alpha.  Going out with him always meant getting stuck with the second best.  In some cases, if he was feeling particularly greedy, the third best.  Despite his ability with women( and his awareness of the reason for his success) he wasn’t all that profound in other areas.  I had him beat.  Another friend of ours, completely inexperienced with women, was Benjamin Franklin compared to him. 

From my blog

Some fairly fine philosophers, theologians, scientific and artistic geniuses were celibates, or more or less celibate. The notion that “unless you’re getting laid, you’re a failure at everything else in life, and everything you say is worthless” is therefore beyond stupid — it doesn’t reflect historical reality. It’s dismissive and divisive and is precisely the kind of carping that we men of various strands need to avoid.

Agree on all counts. Particularly the last sentence.  I have no desire to call out anyone’s chosen lifestyle.

 From Ferdinand’s Blog

The idea that a man’s relative success (or lack thereof) with women is the fundamental measure of his manhood…

Well I guess in animal terms it could be argued that way.  I don’t think, (or at least really hope not) humans are solely animals though.  I would hope I have as much value as Silvio Berlusconi.  Heh. Seriously though, I agree with him.  I think integrity, honor, and decency are much more vital to being a man than how many pussies a guy has plundered.  Ahh, if only integrity and honor made the gina tingle.

, or, even worse, the most important area of his life

In a perfect world I believe marriage and raising children would be the most important thing in most men’s lives.  Again, I say this as a single guy with no kids.  Even in that perfect world though there would be many single men who contribute mightily to society.  In our far from perfect world, it would be a bad idea to blindly follow the marriage/children model.  Conditions on the ground have changed and men should act accordingly. 

If that means the pursuit of a wife or even a girlfriend isn’t the most important thing,  fine by me.  Plenty of ways to contribute to society, grow as a person, and live a contented life. 

is precisely the kind of over-reaching extremism I criticized over at Chuck’s and at Gantt’s. I am a supporter of men learning Game, as you know, but sentiments like that one are just plain silly.

I’m not sure if he is addressing my position specifically, or ideas he has an issue with in general.  If it’s the former I will just say that I sure don’t feel extreme.

To sum up…  

Relationships and marriage generally bring wisdom.

There is more than one path to wisdom.

Marriage and children are vital for a strong and vibrant civilization.

Every man being married and having children is not vital for a strong and vibrant civilization.

A mans inherent value isn’t predicated on his ability with women.

Success with women, although I believe it usually brings wisdom, is morally neutral.

There is more than one path to being a decent man who lived a life worth living.

 

Obsidian, a thoughtful and effective Game advocate left this comment at Ferdinand’s yesterday.  I thought I would respond because I disagree with him, both in tone and substance.

Now, before you or anyone else starts howling, lol, lemme also say, that I find the MRA cause to be legit-I just think that some of their tactics, of which bashing Game is one, is woefully offbase. 

Too broad a brush.  Most MRAs seem to be fine with Game.  If I am right, then it is hardly one of “their” tactics.  I have no problem if he wants to defend Game from the few MRAs (or anyone else for that matter) who attack it.  I do agree that a few MRAs were offbase with regard to their criticism of Game.

If these guy are really serious about making structural changes, again I say they should be involved in the political process, lobbying their Senators and Congressmen, among other things.

Who says they aren’t?  I have all sorts of passionate positions, but I’ll be honest, I don’t email congressmen.  Why? Because its largely ineffective. MRA is in its infancy. Changing as many hearts and minds as possible is about the only effective strategy right now in my view.  Politicians aren’t leaders, at best they are followers.

Now take Glenn Sacks-he’s an MRA that I got mad respect for. He doesn’t spend his time breaking on Playas-instead, he devotes his time to doing just what I said above-lobbying lawmakers, bringing awareness to MRA issues and getting facetime to make his case before a wider public. If all these “opponents” of Game and supposed champions of MRA, HBD and Western Civ are really serious, all they need do is look to Glenn Sacks-he’s shown them the way. They don’t even need to reinvent the wheel.

Agreed.  Most MRAs would agree as well I suspect.  I know I certainly like his style.

 Now personally, I don’t see the MRA movement making any major legal/political headway anytime soon, and for many of the reasons you’ve written about Nova, among other bloggers.

Agreed.  So what?  I write and discuss all sorts of things that aren’t making headway.  In many cases, causes I hold dear are becoming less realistic as time goes on.  If anything, its fun to rag on feminists.  Do you oppose Roissy when he does this?

 Simply put-if you buy into Evo-Psych, and I do-Men are too inherently competitive to cohesive work together to bring about change ala the NOW mold. Not. Gonna. Happen. We’re just not wired that way.

Largely agree.  NOW and other leftist ideas will crumble under their own weight if given enough time.  To the extent that a mens rights movement can speed up the process, all the better.  Should Glenn Sacks, a man just complimented, retire?

 Which is why Game is in many ways the perfect solution, because it’s all individually focused. One doesn’t need expensive lobbying efforts or laws repealed and others passed-all one needs is the right material, a dedication to learn, and a desire to change.

Largely agree.  Game is the micro to MRAs macro.  Game is not a solution because their are no solutions. Game helps though.

Ahh, but you see, that’s the trick-alot of guys out there DO NOT wanna change ANYTHING about themselves. Game is really about growth and self improvement, and many Men are afraid of Change. And again, like Chuck Ross said, the Human Mind can and will concoct all kinds of stuff, all kinds of defences as to why one is a failure. As we all know, Women do this all the time. Now, it seems, so too, do the Menfolk.

Yes, some men don’t work enough at self improvement.  Some are even bitter.  Some blame women for their failures.  Call 60 minutes.  How this invalidates MRA efforts is beyond me.

 I disagree with your view above-a Man who cannot get laid is a sad sight to behold, there’s simply no getting around that fact. Mind you, I’m not talking about the King of All Playas here-just being able to simply get laid with a decent looking chick every now and then. If a guy can’t make that happen, in my book, just about everything about him is seriously suspect.

This is nonsense. Just about EVERYTHING about him is suspect?  I can think of plenty of guys I know, who almost certainly don’t get laid, who are good, decent men.  A 60 year old guy that works at a gas station should be viewed with suspicion because he doesn’t get laid?  Please.  How bout a religious guy that sticks to his principles and avoids pre marital sex?  How bout a guy in a wheelchair?  Really, I love Game and I love Roissy, but man there is more to life than fucking. 

Another thing.  Men tend to gravitate to what they are good at.  Naturals, or men who run Game with ease, will spend more time and effort trying to get laid. 

At some point, for a guy that lacks the natural talents, both mentally and physically, Game and chasing women lose their luster when compared to other pursuits. Lets get real here. Some men, no matter how much they try will always suck with women.  This fact doesn’t make them worthless human beings worthy of suspicion.  They might just accomplish more than the guy out chasing tail all night too.

I gotta tell ya Nova, I’ve never seen so many sorry excuses for Men before in my life.

Exaggerate much?  He could give me his best example of poor MRA behavior and I could counter with all the punks, thugs, criminals and vermin I see everyday in the news.  I’d say they are more “sorry” than the most bitter MRA he could find.

 I mean that. Guys who throw up every excuse under the Sun as to why they refuse to make any changes in their lives for the better, talking about all this abstract, big macro shit as if they gonna be able to solve it-Ha!

Self Improvement and “big macro shit” aren’t mutually exclusive.  Also, men can be brilliant and insightful in one area and terrible in another.  The latter doesn’t negate the former. If I think an MRA is bitter with regard to his personal dealings with women, fine.  It won’t stop me from finding insight into other things he talks about.  Everyone has their biases and weaknesses.  By the way, solutions don’t exist. Only mitigations.  I’m not dreaming of Utopia and most MRAs that I read aren’t either.

 Not buying it one minute. I know the deal. These guys are more than merely afraid. They’re cowards.

I think Obsidian is emoting. I’m sure it feels good.  Way to vague.  Who are “these” guys? 

 Style, before he became such, had more balls, and is actually doing more to change the world, than the whole lot of these Keyboard Warriors, there I’ve said it, and I mean it. Because they can’t even change themselves to meet a nice looking lady for a night-how in the hell are they gonna “save” Western Civ? As we say in the hood, “Nigga, puh-leaaasseee…”

Game has plenty of “keyboard” warriors in their own right.  This fact doesn’t delegitimize Game.  Most MRAs are pretty aware of the long odds they face in “saving” Western Civ.  I agree on Style making worthwhile contributions though.  What this has to do with another man choosing to fight on another front, I have no idea.

So, no, Nova, with all due respect, and I embrace you as a brother, on this one we just gonna have to agree to disagree. All this stuff about MRA, and HBD, and Western Civ, and Conservative this, and Libertarian that, all of that jazz ain’t nothing but elaborate, High IQ smoke and mirrors covering up the simple fact that A, Game WORKS, B, that those who rail against it most don’t have it and C, they’re either too afraid or too angry/bitter or both, to actually try to change their own lives for the better. And I for one am sick and tired of listening to grownassed Men behave like low class Bitches.

Again, Game and MRA aren’t mutually exclusive. Perhaps I should provide a personal example.  Obsidian, I get laid.  I’m not G Manifesto or Roissy, but I do alright.  It’s possible I’m even more successful than you. Who knows. I enjoy the company of women. I’m not bitter or angry(sometimes I should probably be more angry).  I also consider myself a Conservative/ libertarian MRAer.  I have no problem extolling the virtues of Game, using it, and pointed out injustice in our legal system and gynocentric cultural bias. I’ll also submit that learning Game should open a mans eyes even more to injustice and cultural decline not less.

Either you think Game and Mens Rights Advocacy are basically incompatible, or you are using a sledgehammer when a fly swatter would do. 

 You don’t know me, but I’ve been reading you now for close to a year. I often agree with you.  I think you provide valuable insights and a good check on some of the things said around the Roissysphere. You seem like a truly decent and good man.  Just want to let you know that I respect you.  If you read this, I’d like to hear your response.

Money Grows on Trees

I was flipping radio stations today and happened to catch Rush Limbaugh talking about this story coming out of Detroit.  The video is….telling.

 A local reporter from a Detroit radio station interviewed a woman waiting in line for “stimulus” money.  The audio was played on Limbaugh’s program but I couldn’t find it online. 

Instead, here is the transcript…

ROGULSKI( ed: the reporter):  Did you get an application to fill out yet?

WOMAN( ed: the welfare case):  I sure did.  And I filled it out, and I am waiting to see what the results are going to be.

ROGULSKI:  Will you know today how much money you’re getting?

WOMAN:  No, I won’t, but I’m waiting for a phone call.

ROGULSKI:  Where’s the money coming from?

WOMAN:  I believe it’s coming from the City of Detroit or the state.

ROGULSKI:  Where did they get it from?

WOMAN:  Some funds that was forgiven (sic) by Obama.

ROGULSKI:  And where did Obama get the funds?

WOMAN:  Obama getting the funds from… Ummm, I have no idea, to tell you the truth.  He’s the president.

ROGULSKI:  In downtown Detroit, Ken Rogulski, WJR News.

 

Maybe Obama got it from the money trees Michelle is growing in her garden.

I guess the new word for welfare in Orwellian speak is “stimulus”.

 Finally, this reminded me of an exchange before the election…

Some Balance and a Couple Links

I wanted to provide a quick balance to what I wrote yesterday.  Only fair right?  My time is limited so this post will be shorter. I’ve got to go swoop some fly girls tonight.  Ok I’m lying.  I’m just tired. 

Here are a few excesses I sometimes see from advocates of Game.  Feel free to add any others.  This wasn’t my most thought out piece of work. My past writing speaks to my affinity for the principles and many advocates for Game. Like my thoughts on MRA, this is only directed at a subset.

 

At times, Game advocates youth and life experience betray them.  This is clear in some of their assumptions and lack of imagination. 

This lack of imagination causes some of them to have little perspective on the lives of men who aren’t young, unmarried, secular, and in a blue coastal city.  (This is one of the  reasons why I hype Dave in Hawaii so much.)

Some brazenly view bitterness in all cases as weakness and a character flaw.  This speaks to a lack of life experience.  In my view, some bitterness is justified and in many cases can trigger healthy and reasonable responses.  Game reduces the chances of horrible outcomes with women but doesn’t come close to eliminating it.

Some Game advocates suffer from “one size fits all” syndrome. This can lead to simple minded and unrealistic advice.

Virginity isn’t the bedrock of Western Civilization but neither is rampant promiscuity.  I say this not to lecture but as a call for a bit of humility.

I’ll Game, while Rome burns, is a reasonable mindset given the times we live in, but it sometimes leads to dismissive attitudes towards MRAs in general.  

Some “keyboard gamers” talk a good Game (heh), but I suspect fall short in the real world. 

A few have dismissive attitudes about religion and are unable to understand the benefits, drawbacks, and difficulties a church going life provides with regard to the mating dance.  Example: What about men who are religious but also view marriage as an unwise choice given our legal and cultural climate?  What are they to do? 

 

Let me end with a word on Roosh and Pro Male/Anti Feminist.  Whatever you think of their lifestyle choices, both are outspoken and brave enough to express their views. Accepting the scrutiny that comes with it isn’t always easy.  It may not seem like much to hardened bloggers, but I believe it is meaningful.  Both my MRA and Game criticisms weren’t directly aimed at either of them either.  They just provided the spark for more general observations.

 

Here are a couple off topic links…

Did Bill Ayers admit to writing Dreams From My Father?  HT: Ace of Spades

Barack Obama: Alpha or Beta?  HT: Lurker from Roissy’s

Game and MRAs

I wanted to comment on a kerfuffle( yes I used that word) that occurred between proponents of Game and a few MRAs over at Ferdinand’s blog a couple days ago.

If you read here, you know I am both a proponent of Game and consider myself an MRA.  Or, more accurately, an advocate for mens rights.  I’m not sure if writing, conversing, and thinking about mens issues make me an “activist”.  I’m not really a “take to the streets” kind of guy.  Hawaiian Libertarian makes a reasonable distinction here.

I see four main reasons why certain MRAs have a problem with Game and its advocates. 

1. They don’t understand Game.

2. They view women who require “gaming” to be unworthy of a mans attention. 

3. Religious men think it’s immoral. 

4.They resent anything short of complete shunning of worthless, entitled, “Ameriskanks” and think of men who don’t share this view as enablers.

For the purposes of this post I will leave aside #1, 2, and 3. They all tie in with each other. I’ve talked about them before and so have many others.  I’ll just say that Game isn’t only beneficial to young single guys who wear funny hats and nail polish, trolling nightclubs looking to hook up with “whores” (as opposed to madonna’s who just want “good men”).

Here are my thoughts on #4…

First let me say that if an individual man wants to shun relations with women completely, forgo sex, marriage, and children, fine by me.  I don’t have a problem with that.  I’m not here to tell anyone how to live their life. 

I will say that for the vast majority of men, this option is a non starter.  Be they young or old, religious or secular, rich or poor; men want women for sex, children, and companionship.  Complete avoidance of women might be an option for a select few, but can never be sold as an attractive lifestyle choice to most men. 

In addition, not all women are Ameriskanks.  Men can debate the numbers, but who can argue this?  Whether you want to say that 95% of women are decent, or 5%, some women are relationship worthy. ( Our legal system makes extreme caution necessary of course.)

So I ask, short of a lifetime of celibacy, what is the best way for an individual man to deal with women in the year 2009?  Without an answer to this question I will continue to think that these MRAs are unrealistic, dogmatic, out of touch and perhaps, too personally invested.

I think some MRAs opposed to Game resent it because they feel it is more male capitulation.  Women are once again benefiting from men bending over backward to appeal to the special little princess. While it’s true that women are more attracted to men who successfully run Game (intentionally or not), it is men who are benefiting much more in the long run.

Game at the margins, levels the playing field( and what an unlevel playing field it is!) and gives a man more leverage. More leverage means more options.  More options means putting up with less of her shit.  The time and effort put in to “catering” to her gina tingle is well worth it when you consider the alternative. Sucessfully pushing her attraction buttons may mean the difference between a long marriage and a divorce. Not feeling like a lickspittle, pushover, chump, herb/mangina is also an added benefit. 

Another objection seems to be aimed at alpha men.  Maybe a little bit of resentment at all the sex they are lavished with, or again,  that women are getting what they want by having sex with the men they desire.  Game is the wrong target though.  Alpha men, of which there are plenty of naturals, would be scoring in great numbers anyway.  Game may make an alpha a super duper unstoppable alpha, but it is most beneficial for guys a bit farther down the totem pole.

It seems that some MRAs think female hypergamy and an assortment of others behaviors are unique to contemporary, feminist influenced, American women.  It only seems that way because in times past a womans natural animal desires were constrained by cultural norms and the law. Game is a tool that helps a man personally constrain female behavior.  It ain’t a panacea, and its effectiveness is limited by human ability, but its better than nothing.

If men accept female nature for what it is then they will be less likely to wage a futile and unproductive war against it.  Women have always been this way and always will be. Nothing new under the sun.  It would be nice if MRAs don’t start resembling some feminists and their “all men are rapists” ideology.  As much as I rail against unconstrained female nature, I would also hate to live in a world where male nature is unchecked. That said, I still resent being viewed as a rapist and a predator.

Ive said it before and I’ll say it again, MRAs are good at pointing out inequities in the law and destructive behaviors women engage in.  Game advocates are good at pointing out why women are doing it, and on a micro level, the best way to respond. 

Both are necessary and have their place.  Female nature isn’t going to change.  The only way to curb its excesses is legal and cultural change.  Incentives are everything.  I’m not optimistic in the short term of this happening, but I do know shunning women altogether is fanciful and counter productive.

Finally, the tenets of Game can work on platonic relationships with women as well.  I may sound like a sycophantic supporter of Game when I say this, but I believe a priest can benefit from it.  Got to pass those nun’s shit tests after all.  I bet their shaming language is strong.  Think Meryl Streep in the movie Doubt.  I’m exaggerating a bit to make a point.  For a more real world example think: co-workers.  So yes, I believe even celibate men can benefit from Game.

 

I don’t see how it is productive for MRAs, who mainly focus on macro issues, to shun proponents of Game.  They aren’t mutually exclusive.  Men that use the tool of Game on a micro level can be just as supportive of the need for legal and cultural change as the guy going the celibate route.

Litmus tests don’t work for tiny outnumbered “movements” either.  It seems to me a big tent is in order if any progress is to be made.  If MRAs want to be taken seriously on the micro level, they need to offer more than isolation and celibacy as a mitigation.

I’ve made the distinction between Game and MGTOW( the micro to MRAs macro) before, and after thinking about it, dont think this is quite right.  Game is afterall, a tool.  MGTOW is more an attitude or way of life.  A man going his own way can use Game is my point. ( I believe most MRAs agree with me.)

I’ll end by pointing out that my critique was, I believe, shaming language free.  I didn’t call certain MRAs virgins, bitter, or terrible with women.  I’m sure some are.  I also believe that men more experienced with women have a much better understanding of their nature as well.  

In many cases, I believe it to be an unfair charge though.  A 40-year-old guy who did alright with women in his 20s, got married at 30, and got ass raped in divorce court at 40 is a common scenario.  An inept bitter virgin would be an inaccurate discription in this case.  MRAs also come in all ages.  A 60-year-old guy deciding to go celibate is a bit different from a 25-year-old.  Calling the former bitter and horrible with women is silly. Some men don’t have the desire, temperament, or ability to use Game very effectively.  I don’t feel the need to take them to task for it as long as they are as understanding to those who choose to go the Game route.

I welcome any criticism from MRAs that disagree as well.  Just leave out the “you are all fools and a hinderance to mens rights” please.

Four clarifications…

1.This isn’t a criticism of all, or even most MRAs.  After all, I would be criticizing myself if I felt otherwise.  Most seem to get it.

2. I don’t believe Game is the end all, be all, quick fix to everything ailing America.

3.MRAs are free to continue to dislike Game( I won’t hold it against them in other words), but I hope they reconsider their desire to excommunicate those who feel differently.  Again, big tent.

4. Criticism of how the tool of Game is used by individual men is valid and would make for an interesting discussion.

A question for MRAs critical of Game…

Out of curiosity, do you have more contempt for “players” like Roissy or Roosh, or for herb/mangina/swpl/leftist types?

I submit that the former is doing nothing to oppose (and in most cases supports in one degree or another) needed legal change, while the latter works to undermine it.

One last thing…

Talk on the danger of rape allegations ramping up as a result of Game being used with better skill and in higher numbers was discussed in Ferdinand’s thread as well. 

 A few quick thoughts…

Game shouldn’t replace a man having common sense and good judgement.

This might be a reason to stick to “10 Commandments Game” heh.

Is a woman more likely to wake up and regret sex the next morning with an alpha appearing “Gamer” or a nice guy beta? ( I realize this is just one possible false rape scenario.)

Not a rhetorical question. I could see arguments for both actually.  The “alpha” is going to be put in that position a lot more than the beta so his odds of being accused are higher, but the beta is more likely to trigger feelings of “ickyness” than the alpha.  If the beta suddenly seems insensitive to her needs, watch out.  A woman feels that a beta owes her a lot more for sex, especially the regrettable kind( and will resent the beta), than an alpha.  See: Max, Tucker.

This is the one time I would encourage a man to go the lickspittle, fawning beta route. If you were sexing while beta it is in your best interest to do so.  At least for a couple days or so.  More on this another time.

Classic Links and Congrats

Female Misogynist writes about colleges and the decline of character from March of 2008

Elusive Wapiti warns of a potential side effect to MRA from March of 2009

A post on the female marriage strike at Rebuking Feminism from January 2009

Roosh talks about ratings and nationalities from June 2008

Fidelbogen has a message for his feminist readers from January 2007

 

Finally, I wanted to congratulate the Colorado Rockies for making the playoffs by clinching a wild card birth last week. 

If you like baseball, and don’t have a team in the playoffs this year, may I suggest the Rockies for all of your rooting needs.  I’ve followed MLB since 1985 and have never seen a team with a more likeable group of players. 

I can’t pick out a single guy that I have negative feelings for. They all seem to work hard, know their role, and enjoy playing with one and other.  The team really has a throwback feel to it.  No druggies, punks, criminals, or thugs to be found. 

And if diversity is important to you; the Rockies fit that bill as well.  Veterans, rookies and everything in between, black, white and brown, single guys, and married with kids, American and foreign born.

I talk a little bit about the same subject here, after I went to a baseball game.

Now it’s time for me to go watch that other team in Denver take on the Dallas Cowboys.  The 1st real test the Broncos face this year.